Does Gamecube deserve to be called a failure?

[studtrooper]

I've had enough of this. With all the Wii-hype going around and the recent death of GC production, I've been reading about a lot of people saying that the GC was a failure for Nintendo (often siting that it was 3rd in the last gen console race). Does being 3rd (just barely losing to the xbox mind you) mean the existence of the GC was a failure? Here's my pro's and con's:

Con:

1. Barely any decent 3rd party support (just like N64).
2. Barely any decent 1st party support (just like N64).
3. Didn't launch with an original Mario title.
4. Funky controller that disallowed any serious fighter from being played.
4. End of life support was more or less non-existent.

Pro:

1. GC had a few games that positively should be played by any serious gamer (Resident Evil 4, Metroid Prime, Zelda Windwaker/Twilight Pricess, SSBM, Mario Kart: DD, etc).
2. Cheap hardware. A savior to kids and frugal gamers everywhere.
3. Excellent party-based system (Mario Kart/Mario Party/SSBM).

Neutral:

1. Couldn't play DVDs (Not counting useless Panasonic Q).
2. Mini-DVD media constricted game development.
3. Virtually no online presence.
4. Stubborn no-HDTV stance by Nintendo (480p is useless without widescreen!).
5. GBA connectivity thing was retarded.


I totally admit Nintendo could have put more into their machine (maybe that's why Wii is a GC in a smaller case?), but to go and call it a failure and put it down with the likes of Virtual Boy, 3D0, Jaguar, TG-16, Neo Geo, and maybe even the Dreamcast, well, that makes my blood boil. It was a damned good system that deserves respect!

*end soapbox*

[PS3 News]

R.I.P. GameCube is my take on it... soon R.I.P. Wii too. Others?

[Kraken]

The gamecube was a miserable failure. It was only close to the xbox in numbers because the Japanese didn't buy ANY xboxes. If it wasn't for the DS and GBA doing so well, Nintendo would have definatly went the way of Sega. It was largely the fault of those stupid mini-DVDs. Developers couldn't make the games equal on the GC as to the xbox and PS2, and for homebrew you ended up with a franken-machine in order to fit full size DVDs. Xbox didn't have the exclusives, but with a few exceptions, if you got a multi-system game, the xbox version was the best.

That isn't to say that there weren't a bunch of good first party games for it, I would even go so far as to say it has better exclusives than xbox did. But none of these exclusives were as good as what the N64 had. Comparing Wind Waker to OOT and Mario Sunshine to Mario 64 is blashemy. Mario Kart and Mario Party were good as always, but weren't significantly better than on N64. Out of all of the consoles I owned, it was definatly the least played of all time. As much as the GC was a party system, I found myself (and friends) playing the N64 versions of the above games on the xbox.

While the hardware is the same, the wii is different. It the machine for the gamers who don't have time for in depth games anymore. I sat down to play lost planet on the 360 a few days ago, I had an hour, the intro and opening sequence was >30 mins. I love games getting all cinematic, but an amazingly fun game that you can just sit down and play for 30 mins, is what people need, and that is what the wii delivers.

[studtrooper]

Originally Posted by Kraken If it wasn't for the DS and GBA doing so well, Nintendo would have definatly went the way of Sega.

Not really. Remember, the GC started to actually make a profit hardware-wise way before PS2 and xbox could. GBA and DS sales obviously didn't hurt though

Originally Posted by Kraken It was largely the fault of those stupid mini-DVDs. Developers couldn't make the games equal on the GC as to the xbox and PS2, and for homebrew you ended up with a franken-machine in order to fit full size DVDs.

I think we talked about this before. Resident Evil 4 is a good example. It took 2 mini-DVDs for the GC and almost filled one DVD-5 for PS2. But the GC version arguably looks better! Also, just because Nintendo didn't make their system to fit your pirating needs doesn't merit GC being dinged for anything! Besides... mini DVD-R works great

Originally Posted by Kraken That isn't to say that there weren't a bunch of good first party games for it, I would even go so far as to say it has better exclusives than xbox did. But none of these exclusives were as good as what the N64 had. Comparing Wind Waker to OOT and Mario Sunshine to Mario 64 is blashemy. Mario Kart and Mario Party were good as always, but weren't significantly better than on N64.

I might be the only person in the world who's gonna say this, but I thought Wind Waker was better than OOT and Majora's Mask combined. There still isn't a game out that can match its near flawless cell-shading. Also, Mario Kart: DD beats the crap out of Mario Kart 64. Sorry :tongue2 I do agree about Mario 64 being better than Sunshine though.

Originally Posted by Kraken While the hardware is the same, the wii is different. It the machine for the gamers who don't have time for in depth games anymore. I sat down to play lost planet on the 360 a few days ago, I had an hour, the intro and opening sequence was >30 mins. I love games getting all cinematic, but an amazingly fun game that you can just sit down and play for 30 mins, is what people need, and that is what the wii delivers.

Meh, that's what WarioWare is for. The only people I have seen liking the Wii around here are little kids and friends who are constantly high. Wii is a gimmick. One that will hopefully wear off quickly.

[WOWchamp]

The GC wasn't a total failure, and doesn't deserve to be on the list you mentioned and IMO neither does the Jaguar, DOOM on that console was THE SINGLE best rendition of the game I've every played.

While I can see placing the Jaguar on that list due to some of the boneheaded moves that Atari made (none of which are the fault of the console) the GC does not belong on that list.

[studtrooper]

What!? Wasn't Doom like the ONLY reason to have a Jaguar (and that Alien VS Predator game)? Not only that, but the controller was worse than the Wii! I mean, it looked like a touch-tone phone, not something to play Doom on.

Sorry, WOWchamp, but everything Atari touched was trash.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_Jaguar

I also thought Doom played better on my 486, PS1 AND my N64. Maybe not better than the SNES version though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Versions_and_ports_of_Doom

[joker999]

I agree not a total failure, although lacking in 3rd party support. Many many of the first party games were quite fantastic. This however cannot be the only thing that drives a system in many cases, but in this case I think it did it well.

Plus to say it went the way of the Dreamcast...I believe I just bought one and pre-ordered a Dreamcast game, although from Japan and shooters but the DC isn't totally dead. PLUS from my Game development experience and contacts many of them and I enjoyed developing on the DC the most, it was incredibly easy to work with and utilize its just the people mostly who kill systems.

Lastly, one of the main reasons Sega went the way it had is its main financial supporter had been encouraging it for many years (pre-saturn) and they kept pushing for new consoles and he passed away shortly after the DC hit the market (RIP), plust knowing people at Sega now (well since they bought out a few companies) its a great idea, they have some awsome games now on all platforms.

DONE

[eddie420man]

Originally Posted by Kraken While the hardware is the same, the wii is different. It the machine for the gamers who don't have time for in depth games anymore. I sat down to play lost planet on the 360 a few days ago, I had an hour, the intro and opening sequence was >30 mins. I love games getting all cinematic, but an amazingly fun game that you can just sit down and play for 30 mins, is what people need, and that is what the wii delivers.

I disagree, i bought the wii over the weekend and was bored of playin it after 30 mins. I stopped playing and my girlfriend tried, she loved it more than anything. I took it back the next day and returned it. But when i got my ps3 and 360 i played prolly 3 or more hours before i took a break. I think the only reason the wii is doin well is because little kids, girls and zelda. Any real gamer, wouldnt class the wii with the ps3 or even the 360, i think its kind of a joke. And not so revolutionary, nintendo has been messing with that kinda stuff since the early days, they are just able to take it a little farther, gets boring though man, who want to stand around flailing their arms like an idiot when playing a game. Just gimme a controller, and a game like, GOW, RFOM, or HALO and i will be happy for hours.

[studtrooper]

Originally Posted by joker999 Plus to say it went the way of the Dreamcast...I believe I just bought one and pre-ordered a Dreamcast game, although from Japan and shooters but the DC isn't totally dead. PLUS from my Game development experience and contacts many of them and I enjoyed developing on the DC the most, it was incredibly easy to work with and utilize its just the people mostly who kill systems.

DC is just like Saturn in the respect that it died commercially very quickly but the hardcore/homebrew contingent kept it on life support for years after initial game development stopped. DC really is dead now though, as Sega finally stopped producing GD-ROMs a few months back.

Originally Posted by joker999 Lastly, one of the main reasons Sega went the way it had is its main financial supporter had been encouraging it for many years (pre-saturn) and they kept pushing for new consoles and he passed away shortly after the DC hit the market (RIP), plust knowing people at Sega now (well since they bought out a few companies) its a great idea, they have some awsome games now on all platforms.

No. Sega killed the DC because it took them about a year to realize that the DC would not start to make a profit OR get the penetration needed to combat the PS2. With that, they completely decimated their fanbase by pulling the plug on the system two years into its life-cycle. As for "awsome" games now being made by Sega, hopefully you don't mean that new Sonic game :smilew